[Milton-L] "Particular Falls"

JD Fleming jfleming at sfu.ca
Wed Jan 21 22:27:43 EST 2015


Dave Allen at Large. That is all. jdf 

----- Original Message -----

From: "Matthew Jordan" <matthewjorda at gmail.com> 
To: "John Milton Discussion List" <milton-l at lists.richmond.edu> 
Sent: Wednesday, 21 January, 2015 16:00:59 
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] "Particular Falls" 

The most morally appealing version of Hell I've encountered was in a Radio 4 play, a 30-minute thing, some years ago, where Milton was leading someone around telling them what was what. The culmination was a vision of Hell in which bankers, politicos, I dunno maybe PR gurus, were all going about their business completely as normal. Perplexed, our man in the Underworld turns to Milton for explanation, the gist of which is that these people have to go on being themselves, forever and ever... 

This sounds to me like it must have been thought of before, but I am no comparative theologian... 

On 21 January 2015 at 23:34, James Rovira < jamesrovira at gmail.com > wrote: 



I think some of the responses about eternal hell (in Milton or in Christianity) are missing some of Milton's details. Milton seems to me to repeatedly emphasize the existential component of hell over the physical, so that hell isn't mostly importantly a place where God "puts" damned souls, but an existential state made eternal upon death: 


Me miserable! which way shall I fly 	
Infinite wrauth and infinite despair? 	
Which way I fly is Hell; myself am Hell; 	75 
And, in the lowest deep, a lower deep 	
Still threatening to devour me opens wide, 	
To which the Hell I suffer seems a Heaven. 

On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 6:17 PM, Carrol Cox < cbcox at ilstu.edu > wrote: 

<blockquote>
Carter: ". . . God created a universe of perfect beings who were also given 
free will so they could go utterly wrong, and even if they did go wrong 
those who by grace repented would be freed from Hell and death." 

Free will an instrument designed to bring about torture without end? 

That would not be a bad metaphor for capitalist history, but as a cosmic 
principle? 

Carrol 





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-- 
J ames Dougal Fleming 
Associate Professor 
Department of English 
Simon Fraser University 
778-782-4713 

Burnaby -- British Columbia -- Canada. 

He answered and said, I will not; but afterward he repented, and went. Matt.21:29. 


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