[Milton-L] Final lines -- an observation

Judith Herz jherz at alcor.concordia.ca
Fri Feb 25 10:03:51 EST 2011


The date is 1956.  So John's initial respons was (as always) right.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Leonard 
  To: John Milton Discussion List 
  Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 9:40 AM
  Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Final lines -- an observation


  If 1932 is right, the date is interesting, for it precedes Eliot's dismissal of Milton's book eleven catalogue as "a solemn game."  Eliot's essay was published in 1935 (misdated 1936 when it first appeared).  I wonder whether Eliot was thinking of Auden (my initial response, when Hannibal mentioned Auden, was that Auden was thinking of Eliot).  But objections to Milton's catalogues go back at least as far as Johnson..
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Amy Carleton 
    To: John Milton Discussion List 
    Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 5:44 AM
    Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Final lines -- an observation


    I believe the Auden piece to which Dr. Hamlin refers is The Orators (1932?).   




    Amy Carleton
    Northeastern University


    On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 9:04 PM, Jameela Lares <Jameela.Lares at usm.edu> wrote:

      I hope someone will tell us the title of the Auden poem.

      Lord Peter Wimsey also quotes the catalog of the ships in the original Greek when he is pretending to be a magician.  It's in a short story. I can't remember that title either.

      Jameela Lares
      Professor of English
      The University of Southern Mississippi
      118 College Drive, #5037
      Hattiesburg, MS  39406-0001
      601 266-4319 ofc
      601 266-5757 fax
      ________________________________________
      From: milton-l-bounces at lists.richmond.edu [milton-l-bounces at lists.richmond.edu] On Behalf Of Hannibal Hamlin [hamlin.hannibal at gmail.com]
      Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2011 4:02 PM

      To: John Milton Discussion List

      Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Final lines -- an observation


      Someone I found very suggestive and useful when teaching The Iliad some years back was Gregory Nagy. His The Best of the Achaeans is excellent, and there's also Homeric Questions, which deals with questions like oral tradition and myth. I'd also recommend a piece by W.H. Auden (not sure where, off-hand -- perhaps in The Dyer's Hand? -- someone on the list will know) in which he makes a wonderful case for relishing the catalogue of the ships. He says something to the effect that to fail to appreciate this catalogue is to miss something fundamental about Homer's aesthetic.

      Hannibal





      On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 2:33 PM, Samuel Smith <SSmith at messiah.edu<mailto:SSmith at messiah.edu>> wrote:
      Tony and Jim,

      Both essays are available in a single volume published by the New York Review of Books, which includes a third essay on Bespaloff's reading by Hermann Broch.  "War and the Iliad," 2005.

      Samuel


      >>> Tony Demarest <tonydemarest at hotmail.com<mailto:tonydemarest at hotmail.com>> 2/24/2011 12:26 PM >>>

      Jim-

      If you can, Simone Weil's essay on the Iliad: a Poem of Force is excellent for revealing a modern appeal; Rachel Bespaloff has written an essay which may in response to Weil's. Both done during WWII, I think.

      Tony

      ________________________________
      Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 11:12:57 -0500
      Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Final lines -- an observation

      From: jamesrovira at gmail.com<mailto:jamesrovira at gmail.com>
      To: milton-l at lists.richmond.edu<mailto:milton-l at lists.richmond.edu>


      On a note related to our very interesting discussion of the Iliad: I'll be teaching the Iliad for the first time this coming Fall in a Comparative Mythology course.  Any suggestions for teaching it?  Suggestions for individual or group activities, recommended approaches, companion texts, other works to pair with it, etc., would all be appreciated.

      Thank you,

      Jim R


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      --
      Hannibal Hamlin
      Associate Professor of English
      Editor, Reformation
      Organizer, The King James Bible and its Cultural Afterlife
      http://kingjamesbible.osu.edu/
      The Ohio State University
      164 West 17th Ave., 421 Denney Hall
      Columbus, OH 43210-1340

      hamlin.22 at osu.edu/<http://hamlin.22@osu.edu/>
      hamlin.hannibal at gmail.com<mailto:hamlin.hannibal at gmail.com>

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