[Milton-L] Re: porno vs. art?

Horace Jeffery Hodges jefferyhodges at yahoo.com
Thu Nov 24 12:19:48 EST 2005

While Eve may have been no virgin, she was
"pedestaled" by Adam, something that Rafael warned him
about because it placed Eve above her station. Milton
critiques the conventions of courtly love, the
flattery and elevation of the woman to position of
love-goddess to be worshipped.

And how does Satan begin and carry out his temptation?
With Petrarchan-style language of courtly love.

And here's where I'd disagree somewhat with Carol.
Satan's flattery is effective. His words make their
way into her heart because they elevate her, precisely
the promise offered in the temptation scene as Satan's
words begin to have their effect. The fruit is offered
as the solution: This will elevate you, Eve, to

Jeffery Hodges


Richard Strier wrote:

Re one part of Carol's remarks:  whatever Eve is
before the Fall (I'd say a very sexy and intelligent
naked woman), she's not a "pedestaled virgin" (neither
one nor the other), and whatever she is immediately
after the fall (I'd say a very sexy and intelligent
naked woman), she is certainly not "a two-bit whore"
(though I think this contempt for lower class
sex-workers needs scrutiny, and, of course, the whole
"virgin-whore" system is a nonsensical and oppressive
one).  I do think that Adam casts "lascivious eyes" on
Eve before the Fall.  Why not?  Of course, she's not a
courtesan (though, again, I see no reason to have
contempt for such-- some were accomplished poets). 
But why not let her be a little bit of a flirt?  Is
that a crime or a sin or a sign of fallenness?  Milton
praises her delicious amorous delay.  That she is a
femme fatale is part of the plot.

University Degrees:

Ph.D., History, U.C. Berkeley
(Doctoral Thesis: "Food as Synecdoche in John's Gospel and Gnostic Texts")
M.A., History of Science, U.C. Berkeley
B.A., English Language and Literature, Baylor University

Email Address:

jefferyhodges at yahoo.com



Office Address:

Assistant Professor Horace Jeffery Hodges
Department of English Language and Literature
Korea University
136-701 Anam-dong, Seongbuk-gu
South Korea

Home Address:

Dr. Sun-Ae Hwang and Dr. Horace Jeffery Hodges
Sehan Apt. 102-2302
Sinnae-dong 795
Seoul 131-770
South Korea

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