[Milton-L] Tight Miltonic Lines

John Rochelle johnrochellejohn at yahoo.com
Sat Jan 31 09:23:50 EST 2004


I'm wondering what the favorite "compressed" Milton lines are for some of you.  For instance, my favorite is "fear here no dearth."  There is no dearth of blessings, but here death is to be feared (if the injunction is disobeyed).  
 
John Rochelle
Independent Scholar

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Today's Topics:

1. Re: Update on "My Doom" Virus (Carrol Cox)
2. Re: Update on "My Doom" Virus (Zach Davis)
3. Re: Update on "My Doom" Virus (Dan Knauss)
4. Re: Update on "My Doom" Virus (Dan Knauss)
5. Source (death poems, infant mortality, etc.) (Jameela Lares)
6. Re: Source (death poems, infant mortality, etc.)
(Margaret Thickstun)
7. Re: Source (death poems, infant mortality, etc.) (Cobelli at aol.com)


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Message: 1
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 13:41:02 -0600
From: Carrol Cox 
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Update on "My Doom" Virus
To: John Milton Discussion List 
Message-ID: <401AB34E.3E1BD81A at ilstu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii



> Dan Knauss wrote:
> 
> [CLIP] Satan
> has a good offer in this case--like the Mac OS, Linux is not only
> virus-free, it is a free product itself. -Dan Knauss

This is not quite accurate. Linux is only an operating system, and
operating systems are utterly useless in themselves. If you are not an
expert programmer and want to get any use out of Linux, you have to buy
it along with the applications compatible with it from Red Hat or other
companies offering it in usable form.

Carrol


------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 15:14:15 -0500
From: Zach Davis 
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Update on "My Doom" Virus
To: John Milton Discussion List 
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

> This is not quite accurate. Linux is only an operating system, and
> operating systems are utterly useless in themselves. If you are not an
> expert programmer and want to get any use out of Linux, you have to buy
> it along with the applications compatible with it from Red Hat or other
> companies offering it in usable form.
>
> Carrol


Actually, most linux applications are also free, and released under the 
General Public License or some variation of it. Linux distributions 
like Redhat, Suse, and Debian all come with applications (free) like 
Open Office, Gimp (a photoshop equivalent), etc. Even Red Hat was free 
-- it is now more or less defunct, since Redhat is focusing solely on 
the business market, and merged it's home user distribution into the 
fedora project -- although you had to pay for support.

While linux does still have it's bugs, I'm not sure it's fair to say 
that one has to be an expert programmer to use it. It's entirely 
possible to download, install, and use a linux installation without 
having any programming skills at all. One does need, however, some 
patience, and a willingness to learn a new system.

>From what I understand, by the way, most of the evidence around the 
origins of the MyDoom virus suggest that it originated in Russia, and 
that it really has nothing to do with the open source community. There 
is some thinking out there suggesting that the SCO attack "feature" of 
the virus is actually an attempt to mislead the authorities. This was 
recently posted on slashdot.org:

The poster "points out this article in The Atlanta Journal Constitution 
citing "experts who believe the worm was put out for criminal profit 
motives by spammers and not by Linux Advocates." Further on that, 
deadmonk writes "MessageLabs is reporting that the recent Mydoom virus 
seems to have originated in Russia. A place where nobody gives a wet 
slap about a court case in the U.S. Personally, I'm looking for a 
serious apology (or at least a retraction) for the 'alleged' link 
between this ugly little nasty and Open Source / Linux users." Of 
course, there could be evil spammers who also like Linux (or don't like 
SCO), but until someone's caught, or fesses up, it's impossible to say. 
Read on for some more MyDoom updates, including a new variant (with a 
new payload), ramifications for Australians, and a forensic analysis of 
the worm."

And, for those of you who are interested in the current state of 
affairs in the linux and the open source communities, the SCO 
controversy is worth looking into, especially since the intellectual 
property issues that it brings up are in some ways relevant to 
questions around intellectual property in the academy. I tend to think 
that teachers, especially those who put course materials online, would 
be well served by learning about some of the new licensing strategies 
that have emerged from the open source movement, such as various 
Creative Commons licenses.

best,
Zach


------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 15:11:41 -0600
From: Dan Knauss 
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Update on "My Doom" Virus
To: milton-l at koko.richmond.edu
Message-ID: <20040130.151607.844.16.tiresias at juno.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

The distribution versions of Linux that cost something are extremely
inexpensive, but you're not forced to buy them to get software
applications. haven't you heard of open source software? (Which is what
Linux is--hence all the different versions.) Thanks to open source, you
can even outfit a Mac or PC with free, quality office suites (and much
else) that are compatible with the mainstream brands. I don't approve of
the devillish worm-spreaders, but I think there is at least a case to be
made for sympathizing with the devil's party if Redmond's
monopolist-monarchist is God. -Dan

On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 13:41:02 -0600 Carrol Cox writes:
> 
> 
> > Dan Knauss wrote:
> > 
> > [CLIP] Satan
> > has a good offer in this case--like the Mac OS, Linux is not only
> > virus-free, it is a free product itself. -Dan Knauss
> 
> This is not quite accurate. Linux is only an operating system, and
> operating systems are utterly useless in themselves. If you are not 
> an
> expert programmer and want to get any use out of Linux, you have to 
> buy
> it along with the applications compatible with it from Red Hat or 
> other
> companies offering it in usable form.
> 
> Carrol
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Milton-L mailing list
> Milton-L at lists.richmond.edu
> http://lists.richmond.edu/mailman/listinfo/milton-l
> 
> 

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------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 15:22:35 -0600
From: Dan Knauss 
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Update on "My Doom" Virus
To: milton-l at koko.richmond.edu
Message-ID: <20040130.152255.844.20.tiresias at juno.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii


On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 15:14:15 -0500 Zach Davis writes:
> One does need, however, some 
> patience, and a willingness to learn a new system.

The common graphical interface options are so much like Windows, there is
no real learning curve. Lycoris is a Linux distribution whose GUI looks
and works pretty much exactly like Windows XP. Walmart sells PCs online
with Lycoris as an OS option, and I think Dell now ships new PCs with
Linux installed or ready to be installed. It used to be the case that it
was impossible to buy a PC without Windows on it, even if you offered to
pay extra. -Dan

________________________________________________________________
The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!

------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 06:35:40 -0600 (CST)
From: Jameela Lares 
Subject: [Milton-L] Source (death poems, infant mortality, etc.)
To: John Milton Discussion List 
Message-ID:


Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Boyd M Berry wrote:

> My understanding is that in cultures with high infant mrotality, that
> parents commonly do not name or address mortal infants. Jonson's poems
> have always struck me as odd for that reason. But the pattern of not
> addressing the deaths of close relatives may be an echo of that
> distancing.

There's indeed a school of thought that posits a revolution in feeling
toward children--Lawrence Stone, Philip Aries, et al.--but it has
inevitably been challenged by a "continuist" school that insists that
people have always pretty much loved their offspring. Joan Acocella
recently published a review of a Yale social history series, and she
particularly looks at the two interpretations of data on affective
attitudes toward children (_The New Yorker_, August 18-25, 2003). 
Acocella more or less concludes (or at least reports someone else as
concluding) that it is impossible to determine the state of past emotions,
since we only have certain kinds of records to go by.

Jameela
-- 
Jameela Lares
Associate Professor of English
Univ. of So. Mississippi
118 College Drive #5037
Hattiesburg, MS 39406-0001
+601 266-6214


------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 10:10:24 -0500
From: Margaret Thickstun 
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Source (death poems, infant mortality, etc.)
To: John Milton Discussion List 
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii

Jameela--the Natural History article I mentioned argues that, in 
these Brazilian slums struggling with extreme poverty, a mother would 
assess the survivability of a particular newborn and nurture or 
not--invest herself or not emotionally--on that determination (and 
sometimes one infant's survivability would be downgraded because the 
woman had another toddler in which she was already invested). The 
researcher had been struck by mothers who would callously watch one 
infant die, while feeding it only sugar water, but be inconsolable 
after the death of another infant/toddler. So she posits this 
protective emotional response: if it won't live, don't get attached.

It has always seemed to me a plausible psychological explanation for 
attachment in the past as well. I'll find the reference.--Margie

>
>There's indeed a school of thought that posits a revolution in feeling
>toward children--Lawrence Stone, Philip Aries, et al.--but it has
>inevitably been challenged by a "continuist" school that insists that
>people have always pretty much loved their offspring. Joan Acocella
>recently published a review of a Yale social history series, and she
>particularly looks at the two interpretations of data on affective
>attitudes toward children (_The New Yorker_, August 18-25, 2003). 
>Acocella more or less concludes (or at least reports someone else as
>concluding) that it is impossible to determine the state of past emotions,
>since we only have certain kinds of records to go by.
>
>Jameela
>--
>Jameela Lares
>Associate Professor of English
>Univ. of So. Mississippi
>118 College Drive #5037
>Hattiesburg, MS 39406-0001
>+601 266-6214
>
>_______________________________________________
>Milton-L mailing list
>Milton-L at lists.richmond.edu
>http://lists.richmond.edu/mailman/listinfo/milton-l


-- 
Margaret Thickstun
Professor of English
Hamilton College
198 College Hill Rd
Clinton, NY 13323
(315)859-4466

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 11:09:19 EST
From: Cobelli at aol.com
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Source (death poems, infant mortality, etc.)
To: milton-l at koko.richmond.edu
Message-ID: <54.21812549.2d4d2d2f at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"


Dear List:

Perhaps John Boswell's study on fostering and infanticide in the Middle Ages 
(the title escapes me and I have not drunk enough coffee yet) may also 
generate some insight. He seems to posit the view that the public 
institutionalization of child-rearing practices (hospitals and foundling homes; see McNamara, 
Sisters in Arms, the chapter Martha's Part, for a particularly horrific incident 
in 17th century France) in the early modern period was detrimental to infant 
mortality rates and perhaps influenced attitudes about that relationship. I 
read Stone not too long ago and realize that many of his views have been called 
into question. 

Scott Grunow
Department of English
City Colleges of Chicago


------------------------------

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