Fw: Re: [Milton-L] Knowledge, free will, etc.

[Horace Jeffery Hodges]

This doesn't seem to have posted, so I'm sending it again.
 
Jeffery Hodges

--- On Fri, 11/7/08, Horace Jeffery Hodges <jefferyhodges at yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Horace Jeffery Hodges <jefferyhodges at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Knowledge, free will, etc.
To: "John Milton Discussion List" <milton-l at lists.richmond.edu>
Date: Friday, November 7, 2008, 3:14 PM







Mitch, about this:

And know not that I called and drew them thither
My Hell-hounds, to lick up the draff and filth
Which man's polluting sin with taint hath shed
On what was pure . . . (10.629-32) 
It's an interesting passage, but it 'compels' us to ask how God "drew them thither." Did God intervene to do so, or does this refer to God's foreknowledge of possible worlds, with this particular one having been chosen?
 
I recall Abdiel stating that Satan and the other fallen angels are enslaved to their own natures. They are not externally compelled -- and in that sense are free -- but an inner chain of 'natural' necessity stemming from their character forces their hand once they've become fallen.
 
Jeffery Hodges
 
--- On Fri, 11/7/08, Mitchell M. Harris <mitchell.harris at augie.edu> wrote:

From: Mitchell M. Harris <mitchell.harris at augie.edu>
Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Knowledge, free will, etc.
To: "John Milton Discussion List" <milton-l at lists.richmond.edu>
Date: Friday, November 7, 2008, 11:06 AM


I'd disagree, Campbell. Raphael does say it is "higher"--"Differing but in degree, of kind the same" (5.490). As for how Satan knows the tree, Jim Rovira's post is spot on.  


I also want to join Marlene and Michael in saying that God clearly compels Satan to do what he does, but I want to qualify that claim by arguing that he compels him by way of his decree regarding free will. Milton best expresses this theological idea in Christian Doctrine--specifically in the nuanced moments of his sections on God's decrees, predestination, and election, and the hardening of hearts. Satan's compelled will (which, according to Christian Doctrine, still is a free will), however, clearly does not negate that Adam and Eve's free will can remain intact so long as they obey God's command.


I think these concepts (God's decrees, predestination, election, etc.) are expressed more cogently in Book 10 when Sin has some sort of inner feeling that compels her to leave Hell and start building the road to earth with Death:


Methinks I feel new strength within me rise,
Wings growing, and dominion giv'n me large
Beyond this deep; whatever draws me on,
Or sympathy, or some connatural force
Powerful at greatest distance to unite 
With secret amity things of like kind 
By secretest conveyance. (10.243-49)


Later, however, God reveals that it is he, in fact, who called them to this work:


And know not that I called and drew them thither
My Hell-hounds, to lick up the draff and filth
Which man's polluting sin with taint hath shed
On what was pure . . . (10.629-32) 


So in this instance, Sin does not have free will, because God had decreed that on the day Adam ate of the fruit, he would sin and die. But, once again, he never decreed that Adam and Eve had to eat the fruit.


Best,
Mitch Harris




Mitchell M. Harris
Assistant Professor
Department of English
Augustana College
2001 S. Summit Ave.
Sioux Falls, SD 57197
(605) 274-4699
mitchell.harris at augie.edu

"Alack, when once our grace we have forgot,
Nothing goes right . . ."
   - William Shakespeare
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