[Milton-L] Query: Adam's 'Heroic' Self-Sacrifice for Love?

[Carol Barton]

You're more than welcome, Jeffery. Offhand (from others, and specifically on this subject), no, but I'm sure there are some, even though they don't come to mind at the moment (and I have one on EMLS, which you can still access online, I think, which will lead you to one or two). Try "heroic tradition"--Steadman, Bush, et al. for starters--and John Shawcross says something along these lines, too.

Sorry for the rushed response--have two puppies with eight legs crossed . . .


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Horace Jeffery Hodges 
  To: John Milton Discussion List 
  Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 5:59 PM
  Subject: Re: [Milton-L] Query: Adam's 'Heroic' Self-Sacrifice for Love?


  Thanks, Carol. You confirm what I've long suspected about Milton's use of the Romance tradition. Do you know of any studies of this?

  Jeffery Hodges

  Carol Barton <cbartonphd at earthlink.net> wrote:
    Courtly love, Jeffery. In the fallen world (by chivalric standards) what Adam does is heroic. But he errs (and sins) in putting his love for Eve above his love for God; in not trusting God enough to know that He loves Adam enough not to leave him desolate "in these wild woods forlorn" (which would involve a familiar utterance, "Thy will, not my will, be done"); and in failing to offer himself in her stead, any one of which would have been an emulation of the Saviour.

    Adam "sacrifices" his soul to eternal damnation: the Son gives himself, life for life, without in any way acting against the will of the Father. (On the contrary: he is following God's command, to some degree at least against, and in subordination of, his own will, as Gethsemane demonstrates.) Adam tries to thwart God's eternal plan; Christ fulfills it.

    I hope that's helpful.

    Best to all,

    Carol Barton
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Horace Jeffery Hodges 
      To: John Milton Discussion List 
      Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 2:45 PM
      Subject: [Milton-L] Query: Adam's 'Heroic' Self-Sacrifice for Love?


      What traditions does Milton draw upon for his picture of Adam sacrificing himself 'heroically' out of 'love' for Eve?

      I'm thinking of the passage in Book 9 where the fallen Eve confronts Adam with her 'confession' and offers him the fruit:

      9.896-999 (cf. esp. 9.970, 975)

      See also "The Argument" to Book 9:

      "Adam at first amaz'd, but perceiving her lost, resolves through vehemence of love to perish with her"

      Now, I realize that Milton thinks that there is nothing truly 'heroic' about this and that Adam's 'sacrificial love' is a form of self-deception (i.e., 'fondly overcome with Femal charm"), albeit not being truly deceived in the manner that Eve was.

      But is Milton following tradition here (Christian, Jewish, or other) about Adam's 'love' and 'sacrifice,' or is he being original?

      I'm especially interested in two points that Milton brings together: love (even if lust) and self-sacrifice.

      Both of these serve as parallels between Adam and Christ, but with Adam's act of 'loving self-sacrifice' presented as more like a parody of Christ's.

      Since Milton's time, other biblical commentors seem to have picked up on Milton's portrayal, and I'd also be interested in knowing more about that.

      Jeffery Hodges


      University Degrees:

      Ph.D., History, U.C. Berkeley
      (Doctoral Thesis: "Food as Synecdoche in John's Gospel and Gnostic Texts")
      M.A., History of Science, U.C. Berkeley
      B.A., English Language and Literature, Baylor University

      Email Address:

      jefferyhodges at yahoo.com

      Blog:

      http://gypsyscholarship.blogspot.com/

      Office Address:

      Assistant Professor Horace Jeffery Hodges
      School of English, Kyung Hee University
      1 Hoegi-dong, Dongdaemun-gu
      Seoul, 130-701
      South Korea

      Home Address:

      Dr. Sun-Ae Hwang and Dr. Horace Jeffery Hodges
      Gunyoung Apt. 102-204
      Sangbong-dong 1
      Jungnang-gu
      Seoul 131-771
      South Korea 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      _______________________________________________
      Milton-L mailing list
      Milton-L at lists.richmond.edu
      Manage your list membership and access list archives at http://lists.richmond.edu/mailman/listinfo/milton-l
    _______________________________________________
    Milton-L mailing list
    Milton-L at lists.richmond.edu
    Manage your list membership and access list archives at http://lists.richmond.edu/mailman/listinfo/milton-l



  University Degrees:

  Ph.D., History, U.C. Berkeley
  (Doctoral Thesis: "Food as Synecdoche in John's Gospel and Gnostic Texts")
  M.A., History of Science, U.C. Berkeley
  B.A., English Language and Literature, Baylor University

  Email Address:

  jefferyhodges at yahoo.com

  Blog:

  http://gypsyscholarship.blogspot.com/

  Office Address:

  Assistant Professor Horace Jeffery Hodges
  School of English, Kyung Hee University
  1 Hoegi-dong, Dongdaemun-gu
  Seoul, 130-701
  South Korea

  Home Address:

  Dr. Sun-Ae Hwang and Dr. Horace Jeffery Hodges
  Gunyoung Apt. 102-204
  Sangbong-dong 1
  Jungnang-gu
  Seoul 131-771
  South Korea


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  Milton-L mailing list
  Milton-L at lists.richmond.edu
  Manage your list membership and access list archives at http://lists.richmond.edu/mailman/listinfo/milton-l
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.richmond.edu/pipermail/milton-l/attachments/20070826/36b3d063/attachment-0001.html